Epic: Response to Immunologist on the vaccine issue.

“Paul, a Ph.D. Immunologist," left a comment on a VaxTruth article. He decided to check out the website after seeing "a hand scrawled version of your “billboard” on the back of a van and decided to take a look.” Since "Paul, the immunologist" raised a lot of issues that are frequently discussed by others, regarding vaccination against childhood illnesses, I thought I would share his comment and my response. Please feel free to share and add to the discussion. AND get out the shoe-polish!!!
Thanks so much for taking the time to reply. I would like to address your response point-by-point.
You write: “The world is nearly free of polio due to vaccination. Vaccines don’t work? Really?”
My response: Polio has not been eradicated by vaccination. In the U.S. the only cases of diagnosed “polio” in the last several decades were the result of the vaccine (look up vaccine-induced paralytic poliomyelitis). This is currently also happening in countries like India, where three different types of vaccine-induced polio have been identified: 1. circulating vaccine-derived poliovirus (cVDPV); 2. immunodeficiency-related vaccine-derived poliovirus (iVDPV); and 3. ambiguous vaccine-derived poliovirus (aVDPV). What is more relevant to this particular discussion is the fact that the vaccine in the U.S. was not responsible for “wiping out polio” – disease syndromes previously identified as “polio” are still with us; they have just been reclassified and divided up into multiple different diagnoses, including Guillain-Barre Syndrome (a known complication from vaccination) and meningitis (also a known complication from vaccination). Polio (the viral syndrome) is still with us. In the majority of cases, polio actually presents as a mild gastrointestinal illness, with symptoms indistinguishable from other GI viruses. Most people who contract the polio virus have no more significant symptoms and are not likely to be tested for “polio.” Some people who contract polio have no symptoms at all. So to say the vaccine is responsible for eradicating it is just wrong. What really happened was a combination of things, among them the reclassification of the disease by symptoms (addressed already) and the banning of DDT, which produces identical symptoms to paralytic polio in those who are poisoned by the pesticide. If you research the “polio epidemic” in the U.S., you will find that the “outbreaks” of paralytic polio occurred mainly during the summer months, and were clustered in areas of the country where there is a high concentration of agriculture (and pesticide use), and those children who were most often affected were also swimming in lakes, rivers and streams that were contaminated with DDT resulting from run-off from farming. If you choose to research this further, please check out the three-part series on the polio vaccine on VaxTruth.
You write: “The ones [vaccines] that have been proven through clinical trials to work do work…”
My response: How do they work? What is the measure? The clinical trials measure antibody response in the blood. What does that mean? Are the antibodies really protective against the infectious agent? Are they the body’s response to the infectious agent being paired with neuro-immune toxins (aluminum, formaldehyde, polysorbate 80?) We don’t know what the body is reacting to and we don’t know if those antibodies actually mean anything in the way of protection from disease. What we do know is that the clinical trials tell us nothing about the safety of vaccines. That’s because there are no true control groups in the clinical trials for vaccines. They are routinely tested against other vaccines. The adjuvant is also routinely used as a “placebo.” As an immunologist, I’m sure you will agree that a true placebo must be something that does not cause a physiological response. Since the adjuvant is designed to ramp up the immune system (that’s why it’s in the vaccine in the first place), by definition it cannot be a placebo. When there is no placebo, there cannot be relevant information on the incidence of serious adverse effects between those who receive the vaccine and those who do not. We need vaccinated vs. unvaccinated studies for that and those have not been done. Comparing the incidence of disease (and long-range health outcomes) among vaccinated and unvaccinated children is also the only way to tell whether or not the vaccines “work” to eradicate the “dreaded childhood illnesses” AND to tell if doing so is really a good thing in the long run (more below on that).
You write: “…however we are not clones and thus there can be differences in response due to genetic and physiological differences.”
My response: Exactly. So why on earth are we vaccinating 100% of the pediatric population as if our children are all the same?
You write: “Come on. Anyone can find exceptions to ‘the rule’, but in the vast majority of cases vaccination is safe and effective.”
My response: My daughter was an “exception to ‘the rule.’ Vaccination with the TDaP at age 15 nearly killed her. She has a milk allergy and history of seizures. Nobody ever told me that the vaccine was cultured on cows milk protein and that she could die from anaphylaxis as a result of injecting that protein into her body. As an immunologist you should be aware of the issues with injecting food proteins along with 1,500 mcg. of aluminum to ramp up the immune system. I don’t care if “the vast majority” of cases don’t die. I care about my daughter and the significant minority of cases who are apparently deemed “acceptable collateral damage.” As for being effective, the TDaP and DTaP vaccines are NOT effective against a significant number of cases of whooping cough, because the bacterial strain in the vaccine (Bordatella Pertussis) is not the same strain that is causing current outbreaks (Bordatella Parapertussis). The vaccine not only does nothing to protect against parapertussis, it is CAUSING the outbreaks by increasing the colonization of parapertussis in the lungs by up to 40-fold.
You write: “Yes, there are on-going attempts to make vaccines to terrible diseases (e.g, HIV and malaria) where success has not been reached (those organisms are ‘shape-shifters’ changing their antigens often) and it would be incorrect to say those don’t work (yet). And yes, I have a PhD in immunology (I’m a different one than the one that garnered your ire), but since I don’t want to get into a war of words, I’ll remain anonymous.”
My response: There are many other viruses and bacteria that are capable of mutating and changing their make-up, in their efforts to avoid eradication. This happens with bacterial infections for which antibiotics are prescribed and is the reason why physicians routinely instruct their patients to “take this medication exactly as prescribed, and for the full length of the 7-10 day course.” If bacterial (and viral) infections can change to make them immune to antibiotics over the course of 7-10 days, how are we supposed to believe vaccines developed years ago, targeting one strain of bacteria (or virus) are still effective now? This is exactly what has happened with the pertussis vaccine (addressed above). It is also what has happened with the prevnar vaccine, which used to contain 7 strains of streptococcus bacteria and is now up to 13 strains of strep. Partial coverage vaccines (those which do not cover ALL strains of virus or bacteria) result in those strains that are not covered becoming more virulent (causing disease when they were not previously problematic) and more resistant to treatment with antibiotics. (BTW… developing more vaccines is not the answer. Strengthening the immune system and allowing our children to get sick and establish natural immunity through recovering from childhood illness is the answer.)
You write: “You’re entitled to your opinion of course”
My response: Thank-you.
You write: “…but if we all just stopped getting our kids vaccinated you’d see a fairly quick resurgence of mumps, rubella, measles, etc. as these diseases are not gone – go to third world countries where they don’t have vaccines and you’ll see the effect.
My response: I highly doubt that we would see epidemics of infectious diseases return if we stopped vaccinating. However, if we DID see a return of mumps, rubella, measles and (horrors!) chickenpox, it would not concern me one bit. These childhood illnesses were never big killers in the United States. There was a reason for them and there was a reason they occurred in childhood – to strengthen the child’s immune system and to provide natural boosters to adults who cared for those children during their (short-lived) illnesses. Catching measles and recovering from it often resulted in significant gains in developmental milestones, cognitive skills and in the strength of the immune system. Ditto for mumps. Denying children the right to fight through the chickenpox has not only denied their immune systems the experience needed to later fight off other, similar viruses, it has led to epidemics of shingles in young adults, which is FAR more dangerous than chickenpox ever was for young children. But, hey! It gave the pharmaceutical companies the chance to develop and profit from another vaccine, so what the heck, right?
You write: “I certainly hope that no one’s child is hurt or becomes sick, but calling for the end of vaccination is short-sighted.”
My response: Many children have been hurt by vaccinations. Many are sick with lifelong, debilitating illness as a result of vaccination. Many children have died from vaccination. Calling for the end of mandatory vaccination is not only not short-sighted, it is long overdue.
You write: “You may ask, why comment at all – I saw a hand scrawled version of your “billboard” on the back of a van and decided to take a look.”
My response: HALLELUJAH!!!